Blog Entry

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Posted on: April 27, 2008 10:57 am
Edited on: April 29, 2008 8:40 am
 

Look this is something that as Peter Griffin would say, "...really Grinds my Gears!!" I am having a difficult time getting over the offseason moves involving Johan Santana. The thing is where do I start...

Ok lets start here.. I feel as though somehow I've been wronged. I feel dirty and unclean. I first started attentively following baseball and the Yankees in 1983. Even before then the Yankees logic was go out and get it. Or as most around these parts say buy it. From Reggie Jackson to Ken Phelps to Tino Martinez to Alex Rodriguez (I cant believe I just put those four names in the same sentence. Not the best point but its looks cool) the Yankees have never been affraid to go out and pay for Free Agents with the Batting and Defensive skills. But I cant recall when the Yankees have really chased after a top pitching prospect? Enter Johan Santana...

I would like to break down some tid bits about Johan that are important here...

He should win 20+ games for the next 5 years on a strong contending team... Minnesota has to get rid of him... enter the New York Yankees and the Boston Red Sox... the Yankees are willing to package and negotiate... Taken from the Daily News, "Yankees' offer of Phil Hughes, Melky Caera and another prospect"

As well the Red Sox who I think enter the market just to push the price up.... talks break down between the AL East and the Indians and out of nowhere the Mets are right in the front runnings.

BUT the Mets have much to offer... they are going to walk away from this deal with perhaps the best pitcher is baseball...FOR JUNK why....? Because Cleveland has no choice and they need to get something because they cant sign Johan Santana. They just cannot keep him. So what do the Mets do they offer 4 of there top 7 prospects.

Ok so if its 4 of the top 7 thats means they got the Mets top 7 prospect... which equates to like the 230th prospect in all of the Minor Leagues... Carlos Gomez ( < Melky Cabrera) and pitchers Phillip Humber, Kevin Mulvey and Deolis Guerra ( < Phil Hughes + another prospect) You notice I added a less than sign < in there... because in my humble opinion those Mets prospects are less than what the Yankees were offering...

Melky Cabrera > Carlos Gomez if you want to debate it thats fine... but Melkys performance so far this year compared to Gomez and the fact that Melky is an everyday player and Carlos Gomez seems like he is still trying to find himself. Defensively I take Melky any day of the week and twice on Sundays...

Now the pitching... all Minor Leaguers (Humber has 1 start a no decision in the Majors) the Mets offered who have shown nothing more than potential future journeymen in the Minors... vs. Phil Hughes who was pitching if I recall correctly a No Hitter into the 7th before hurting himself last year. This kid has shown the potential to play at the big league level and a 15+ game winner far more than the 3 prospects the Mets offered. +1 to be named...

Everyone says to me.. oh Casper the Yankees cant afford it... yes they can Jason Giambi is done after this year.. $24 million freed up.. and Mike Mussina will not be back whats that..? Another $13 Million...

Imagine the 2009 Starting Rotation:

  1. Johan Satana
  2. Chien-Ming Wang
  3. Joba Chamberlain
  4. Andy Pettitte (hed come back for one more year)
  5. + Whoever you could find... maybe Ian Kennedy is that guy, Darrell Rasner, Alan Horne.. lets going on in the Minors...
Category: MLB
Comments

Since: Jan 4, 2008
Posted on: April 29, 2008 4:33 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Thats pretty much what I am trying to say... LOL in a round about way..

I also have to apologize there are a few mistakes in there too.. I think I say Cleveland a few times when I mean Minnesota... sorry.. I do know the difference believe it or not... I am just not the best writer and sometimes I jusdt put stuff on paper and dont know where it came from..




Since: Sep 23, 2006
Posted on: April 29, 2008 11:38 am
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Fans of other teams can say what they want. It sounds like Casper is saying two things here: if hindsight is 20/20, given the poor starts of Hughes and IPK, the Yankees should have done the deal. Maybe they should have done the deal regardless.

Second, you can talk about the Met's prospects all you want, but the fact is at the time of the trade, Minnesota preferred the Yankees' package of players over what the Mets were offering.



Since: Mar 31, 2008
Posted on: April 28, 2008 8:04 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Johann Santana never pitched for Cleveland...he played for the Twins. The only thing he ever did for Cleveland was lose 5 games to them last year.

It's funny how you say the Yankees never went after pitching...Mike Mussina, Roger Clemens, Randy Johnson, and Carl Pavano all come to mind....are you saying those guys weren't good pitchers? It seems to me that the Yankees overpaid for all of them.

I do agree with you that Johann should be a Yankee. I think the Yankees are kicking themselves right now that they didn't pull the trigger on that one. Maybe they should have just let ARod walk like they said they were going to do, and sent Hughes, Kennedy, Chamberlain, and Cabrera to the Mets for Santana, then turned around and signed him to a long term deal. I guess the Mets one-upped the Yankees...again. Unfortunately, I don't feel sorry for the Yanks and am actually going to enjoy watching them wallow in self destruction this season.




Since: Jan 4, 2008
Posted on: April 27, 2008 4:08 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

It is amazing to see what even educated Yankee fans, like yourself, have to say about high priced talent. I see where you are going with this but maybe you guys should be happy once in a while considering you have a team of studs.  The 20/20 hindsight being applied here just adds to the "Yankee fan" perception in the USA. Spoiled.  

 

Hey Avalon:

Now look.. you are an Eagles fan... and you guys booed Santa Claus for Petes Sake (sarcasm)...

... I just feel how did we let this guy get away... and also it wasnt really 20/20 or hindsight because I was screaming for it at the time...

I admit I am being childish of course about this because its in the past and its time to move on... but you can see my frustration no...? Especially with the way things have gone with Phil Hughes... I just dont see how a bird in hand (Johan Santana) is worth 2 in the bush (Phil Hughes + a prospect) Melky Cabrera was talent but not the caliber of Johan to be and even trade...

Thanks for the comments... and remember its my rant... LOL




Since: Apr 27, 2008
Posted on: April 27, 2008 2:50 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

It is amazing to see what even educated Yankee fans, like yourself, have to say about high priced talent. I see where you are going with this but maybe you guys should be happy once in a while considering you have a team of studs.  The 20/20 hindsight being applied here just adds to the "Yankee fan" perception in the USA. Spoiled.  



Since: Jan 4, 2008
Posted on: April 27, 2008 12:35 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Hey BigPappi:

My frustration here is with the Yankees organization... I think they should gotten the deal done. None of the others by any org. was that great.. but the Yankees I think should have sealed the deal and not walked on....

Carlos Gomez is a solid defensive outfielder who has amazing speed and can develop power as he grows. He is not trying to find himself. He's great in the field, a demon on the basepathes, and has sneaky power.

He is good/average defensively in the outfield. But he hasnt played a full season and I do not believe though due to his arm strength currently he is as good as Melky Cabrera in the CF Spot... not discrediting him but I just think Melky is a notch above... Melky so far this year has shown more pop in his bat... and better average. Carlos Gomez I think by most reports is pretty overrated currently. They give him way too many props for a guy who hasn't played a full season yet having around I think like what 150 ABs last year. Right now so far this year theres been ups and downs from Gomez... SBs up.. plate discipline a down. He has potential of course. All around I think when analyzing what the Yankees offered Melky was more than Carlos. One problem I have is everyone thinks Gomez is a 5-tool player and I really dont think he is.

Philip Humber has struggled since getting surgery, but still has potential.

 

Kevin Mulvey is a good pitching prospect who can develop into a solid starter at the major league level.

Kevin Mulvey when you look at his line so far this year has been good in AAA. He has made the most of it.. and will probably get a call up before Humber at this rate.

You HIGHLY underrate Deolis Guerra

Hes still single A prospect who might make AA by the end of the year. Has a flame thrower of an arm. But the analysis I have seen says he needs to develope off speed and breaking material which he seems to have none of.

Like you pointed out we wont for another 3-4 years... to see if the Twins Scouts knew what they were thinking... but its still an awful lot of speculation for a sure thing which Johan Santana is... no one in the Mets, or Yankees or Red Sox offers were sure things as Johan Santana is...

Always chatting with you Pappi!! Educational for myself... and thanks for the criticism....

Phi Humber started out slow his first start but has since battled back to being serviceable. I think out of all of everyone he will certainly be the least contributor.



Since: Aug 29, 2006
Posted on: April 27, 2008 12:18 pm
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Perfectly said, bigpapiandmanny!

I would take Philip Humber over Phil Hughes any day. I mean, if Hughes is doing as poorly as he is with a Yankee lineup behind him, what good is he in Minnesota?

I'd say the Twins got the best deal possible.

Gomez is still young, developing, and I know Melky is, too, but I feel that Gomez will get further, and last longer.

And then we got three above-average pitcher prospects. At first, when I saw the trade, I felt it was as pitiful as possible. But now, I really like what the Twins have. Right now, they are last in the division, but as people get  used to the everyday push of the season, they will get better.

Maybe Santana does belong in New York, in 5 years, they will overpay him to play for another 5 years, and he'll underproduce.




Since: Aug 24, 2006
Posted on: April 27, 2008 11:59 am
 

Johan Santana should be a Yankee...

Carlos Gomez is a solid defensive outfielder who has amazing speed and can develop power as he grows. He is not trying to find himself. He's great in the field, a demon on the basepathes, and has sneaky power.

Kevin Mulvey is a good pitching prospect who can develop into a solid starter at the major league level.

Philip Humber has struggled since getting surgery, but still has potential.

You HIGHLY underrate Deolis Guerra, a 19 year old flamethrower who was the top pitching prospect in the Mets farm system. The kid would have turned more heads in the Mets farm system if it wasn't for Fernando Martinez being there too.

And how can you say they show nothing more than potential future journeymen in the minors? That's just not true, and by being with an organization who usually doesn't make big splashes in the FA market, they won't be blocked by FA signings, and will all inevitably see major league time. Whether or not they have success there remains to be seen, but when defining success in the majors, you brought up Phil Hughes's almost no-no??? That makes no sense at all, plenty of crappy pitchers have taken no-hittes into the 7th inning.

I mean, come on, Anibal Sanchez has more no-hitters than Roger Clemens, Tom Glavine, John Smoltz, Greg Maddux, Johan Santana, Jake Peavy, C.C. Sabathia, and Josh Beckett combined. And Sanchez only has 1 no-hitter, who would you rather have on your team?

Also, the Twins were rushing to make a deal before Spring Training started, and the Yankees and Red Sox, getting impatient, pulled their best offers from the table. So, the Twins were waiting for more from those 2 teams, and weren't expecting them to grow impatient and pull their offers.

But, in the end, you can't argue with the Twins scouts until 3-4 years from now. The Twins organization has a good eye for scouting players and seeing potential. It's simple, they liked the Mets deal more than the Yankees deal. More prospects equals a better chance at scoring with at least one of them.

 



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